You have just entered room "Chat 10123047214187593343."
gorclon1: hey
se2srini: hello! guys
Eceguru: hi
michaelwalsh327: kabe, is vivek coming?
kabev1: Yeah, let me ping him a sec
salcs329 has entered the room.
salcs329: hi all
kabev1: go ahead and start w/o Vivek, he'll be here shortly
gorclon1: homework 2 time?
michaelwalsh327: OK, but he'd better be buying you guys donuts tomorrow.
michaelwalsh327: Note: Homework 2 has changed.
salcs329: is due date still feb 20
starkiller76: we need to split up into 2 groups again
gorclon1: yeah
Eceguru: where is the assignment
kabev1: Any one against just keeping the same groups?
Eceguru: that's fine with me
michaelwalsh327: http://wiki.cs.uiuc.edu/SEcours e/329+Homework+2+Spring+ 2003
gorclon1: sure....
salcs329: same group,,,ok
michaelwalsh327: yea, why not.
kabev1: ok let's do that then..... done
kabev1: :-)
michaelwalsh327: althouhg, at some point we ought to be working w/ different collections of people.
gorclon1: true
x V DoGG x has entered the room.
x V DoGG x: sorry, i was late again
salcs329: i have ques about project.. let me know when q&a starts
kabev1: ok let's do up an agenda
michaelwalsh327: 1) last week's action items
kabev1: 2)Iterations
x V DoGG x: 3) Roles
kabev1: Anything else?
michaelwalsh327: 3 is part of 1
kabev1: 4)Hw 2
salcs329: open q&a
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: lets get started
x V DoGG x: #1.......
x V DoGG x: has everyone downloaded and compiled the code?
michaelwalsh327: oui
x V DoGG x: please say yes or no
x V DoGG x: yes
gorclon1: yes
kabev1: yes
Eceguru: yes
starkiller76: yes
salcs329: yes
se2srini: no.
x V DoGG x: mike - what is oui?
michaelwalsh327: yes in french. not that I speak french. just being smarmy.
Eceguru: well, cut it out
Eceguru: :-)
gorclon1: mike - what is smarmy?
x V DoGG x: srini - why not? did you have trouble? or no time?
se2srini: no time vivek. I'll catch up. sorry about that team.
x V DoGG x: anyone have any suggestions about the cvs structure?
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: just making sure there weren't any problems
se2srini: ok
x V DoGG x: #1.2 Did everyone pick roles?
x V DoGG x: yes or no
x V DoGG x: yes
gorclon1: no
michaelwalsh327: yes
gorclon1: where
michaelwalsh327: http://wiki.cs.uiuc.edu/SEcours e/Summary-1-29-03
michaelwalsh327: this was discussed last week, all should have signed up.
kabev1: yes
Eceguru: well, if no one wants doc. manager i'll do it
salcs329: yes
gorclon1: ah, there it is.. hm MW is everything?
se2srini: yes. I'll be document manager and code reviewer. I may need some suggestion on responsibilities though.
x V DoGG x: ok....
michaelwalsh327: nah, that was last semester - mostly signed up to do reviews.
Eceguru: i can help, i just didn't see anyone sign up for it
x V DoGG x: some of you may have signed up on
x V DoGG x: the first set of roles
x V DoGG x: but perhaps we should choose if we are going to use the original roles or the new RUP ones
x V DoGG x: so that we are consistent
michaelwalsh327: I think we should start w/ RUP and add anythi we think we need.
salcs329: orig make more sense to me for this proj
x V DoGG x: the original ones seem to be a subset for the most part.... so perhaps if we go with the superset, we will be better off
Eceguru: yeah, but then we'll be signing up for many redundant ones i think
gorclon1: that's ok I think
x V DoGG x: yeah
michaelwalsh327: we can also eliminate redundancies.
gorclon1: right
x V DoGG x: i agree redundancies are ok
x V DoGG x: ok
kabev1: let's have only one person update the wiki right now
x V DoGG x: so we don't all modify at once
x V DoGG x: i will update
Eceguru: alright
gorclon1: go for it
x V DoGG x: you guys tell me
kabev1: ui designer
michaelwalsh327: <- has RUP book open if defeinitions are needed
x V DoGG x: any suggestions to eliminate redunduncies?
salcs329: bug tracking & code reviewer
gorclon1: maybe everybody first sign up, and then eliminate redunduncies
Eceguru: it just seems that there will be some categories that everyone wil be doing
Eceguru: like all the reviewer roles
michaelwalsh327: that's OK, too.
gorclon1: true
Eceguru: maybe just say all for those
x V DoGG x: Please provide initials
kabev1: I'll do tool specialist, but who knows how much of a specialist I'll be
x V DoGG x: sal?
Eceguru: i'll do test designer, tool specialist
se2srini: what does MW mean
michaelwalsh327: Michael Walsh
gorclon1: michael walsh I think
se2srini: ok :-)
Eceguru: use initials
salcs329: FR
kabev1: KVB: CM, UI, Tool Specialist
x V DoGG x: How does sal map to fr
gorclon1: lol
salcs329: sal for initial is ok
michaelwalsh327: Faisal "Sal" Razzaq
se2srini: Is anyone deployment manager here? if not I can be that.
x V DoGG x: ahhh
salcs329: SAL: Bug tracking, Code Reviewer, Developer
michaelwalsh327: (suggest adding bug tracking role)
x V DoGG x: ok, i just updated the page
x V DoGG x: check the changes
starkiller76: I'm I the only one who thinks we have way too many roles
x V DoGG x: i am now moving the roles down
x V DoGG x: srini - what are your initials
gorclon1: we could also switch roles from time to time
se2srini: SK: Document Manager, Deployment Manager, Code Reviewer and Implementer
kabev1: the roles tend to blur together
michaelwalsh327: We'll remove stuff we don't need, add what we do,and then say why we did it - following RUP and modifying it to suit us like good little SE students.
se2srini: I agree.
gorclon1: is anybody working on wiki now?
starkiller76: no
gorclon1: k
gorclon1: my turn
michaelwalsh327: wait, I thought Vivek was.
gorclon1: hm
gorclon1: ok
kabev1: Vivek is
x V DoGG x: yes
x V DoGG x: i am
gorclon1: oh, I already have stuff on there
x V DoGG x: what changes
x V DoGG x: do you want to make
x V DoGG x: i am desperatly typing back and forth
x V DoGG x: trying to keep up
x V DoGG x: did you just make changes?
x V DoGG x: if so, please don't submit
gorclon1: I made changes before
gorclon1: done already
x V DoGG x: ok
gorclon1: RG
x V DoGG x: hopefully we didn't loose anything
x V DoGG x: i am going to save
x V DoGG x: please recheck
gorclon1: ok
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: its saved
x V DoGG x: please check
gorclon1: looks good
x V DoGG x: i tried to move the relavent roles down
kabev1: Move CCB down also
kabev1: That is a defined role in RUP
salcs329: Is Course Developer == Code Developer?
michaelwalsh327: CCB = Change Control Manager - accoridng to text:
michaelwalsh327: "Role is usually played by a CCB"
michaelwalsh327: Course Developer: develops trainign materials for end users
x V DoGG x: who wants to be doc manager?
kabev1: ok, so we should move it to the RUP roles then right
michaelwalsh327: That's an undefined role. If you can define it, someone can do it.
x V DoGG x: ok, was it you last mike?
kabev1: Vivek, add you and me to the Change Control manager
x V DoGG x: its kinda a website/docs organization role...
x V DoGG x: yes
x V DoGG x: kabe - isn't it the same as config manager?
x V DoGG x: no
x V DoGG x: never mind
x V DoGG x: i see
gorclon1: isn't that the Website Admin
michaelwalsh327: OK. That sounds like "Project Reviewer" in RUP.
starkiller76: Guys, I have to be at work by 5 tomorrow
gorclon1: the PRA then?
gorclon1: ok
starkiller76: so I am going to log off
x V DoGG x: PRA?
gorclon1: when does group one want to meet?
x V DoGG x: ok
gorclon1: for homework 1
starkiller76: I will be posting a revised project plan this week
starkiller76: we need to start working on the code
gorclon1: PRA = Project Review Authority
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: i have done the final update
starkiller76: I really have nothing to add to all this role talk
x V DoGG x: please review
x V DoGG x: and lets move onwards
gorclon1: HW2 meeting times?
x V DoGG x: ok
gorclon1: Wednesday night?
x V DoGG x: #1.4) Please add the hw1 docs to the cvs repository. Who will do that?
michaelwalsh327: you should be asleep by now, star killer.
michaelwalsh327: I will add change control doc
x V DoGG x: wed. is bad for me
x V DoGG x: tuesday works
x V DoGG x: tuesday @ 8 or 9pm?
x V DoGG x: kabe & dave any comments?
gorclon1: tuesday at 9 is ok with me
starkiller76: I don't need no stinking sleep
Eceguru: we having one big meeting for hw2?
starkiller76: :-)
kabev1: 9:00 is fine
gorclon1: um, I think we will have two seperate meetings
Eceguru: that's what i thought
gorclon1: so goup two people could meet other than tomorrow night
x V DoGG x: i think each group will be separate
x V DoGG x: oops spelling
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: Vivek will add the other doc
x V DoGG x: already done.... wow vivek is fast
x V DoGG x: kabe - what is iterations?
x V DoGG x: that is next on the agenda
kabev1: Just want to throw out there when are we gonna begin developing again and doing iterations?
kabev1: Should we be working on the project while we are doing the homeworks?
x V DoGG x: comments?
michaelwalsh327: yes, definitley.
starkiller76: Yes
michaelwalsh327: (we're scheduling elsewhere, since you were scheduling here)
kabev1: MIke what does that mean?
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: pls inform when you are done
starkiller76: I will work with vivek to identify code that needs to be developed next iteration
michaelwalsh327: we are now done.
starkiller76: Then add that to the project plan, with target dates
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: good plan
x V DoGG x: we will try to get that done by next meeting
salcs329: Where will be the updated plan posted?
x V DoGG x: we will try to post it by next meeting
kabev1: I think we need to begin the process of bugs/enhancements/CCB.
Eceguru: cool
x V DoGG x: yes.....
x V DoGG x: once we start working on the core functionality
x V DoGG x: any new features, bugs, or submissions should follow the process
kabev1: Let's do this...
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: what is this?
kabev1: Figure out the requirements we have implemented and which ones we have not then submit them to be tracked ands assigned
Eceguru: (*theme to a-team playing*)
michaelwalsh327: that's not really good for change control...
michaelwalsh327: since those aren't changes - we were going to use the change suystem for feature requests (things not in reqs) and bugs (things broken)
Eceguru: i agree
michaelwalsh327: Process for seeing where we are doen need to be gone through, though.
michaelwalsh327: Then it's PM's job to assign, track current iteration tasks.
starkiller76: I agree with Mike
starkiller76: plus it reduces development overhead
michaelwalsh327: The 4 of you guys from last semester should draw a line where you think we are (sson), and then bugs can be reported where we've fallen short.
kabev1: ok, so we are not going to use the change erquest system as the delta from iteration to iteration?
michaelwalsh327: no, that stuff'll be in the project plan.
x V DoGG x: makes sense
se2srini: I think we should set up Bugzilla first and everyone can start reporting bugs as they start looking at the system
salcs329: Bug tracking is already available at our sourceforge site
kabev1: Are we using bugzilla?? I thought we were using the SF site for changes
michaelwalsh327: We should finish tracking set up soon (as in, I'll put up a sample report), but we can't really report bugs until we know how far we think we are.
Eceguru: yeah, the sf site
Eceguru: its all built in
x V DoGG x: yeah
se2srini: ok
x V DoGG x: dave and i will try to break up things by module
x V DoGG x: which will imply the rest is completed
x V DoGG x: so everyone can use that as a base line
Eceguru: alright
Eceguru: how long are you thinking it'll take?
starkiller76: I think that would be the most agile approach at this point
x V DoGG x: <agile> - i like the word
x V DoGG x: lets see how far we are by monda
x V DoGG x: and go from there
x V DoGG x: i don't know how much will be involved so i am not making any promises
Eceguru: ok, i figure it'll take some time
x V DoGG x: but we will try our best
Eceguru: especially with hw as well
x V DoGG x: yeah
x V DoGG x: for sure
michaelwalsh327: note - hw 3 is due two weeks after hw1 - we need to start working on project ans classwork in parallel.
gorclon1: some of us can focus on the hw this week
michaelwalsh327: that is, 2 weeks after hw2 - there's not really any hw breaks this semester, it seems.
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: we can move to general q&a
salcs329: What kind of hardware (network card, setup) we need to test the app
Eceguru: just ethernet
starkiller76: Yep
salcs329: wireless?
Eceguru: basically an internet connection will do
Eceguru: wireless isn't necessary
gorclon1: so we care just testing over the internet then
Eceguru: yeah
x V DoGG x: yeah, as long as you have a connection to the internet, you can use the discovery part (only thing implemented)
Eceguru: actually, it will work with dial up as well right?
x V DoGG x: when we begin implementing file transfer
gorclon1: dialup should be fine
Eceguru: i have broadband so i'm not sure
kabev1: correct Isaac
starkiller76: We need to basically focus on content management this semester
x V DoGG x: one will need two computers, or two instances of the app on one machine (not sure how clean that is)
michaelwalsh327: "wireless" and "linux" were just buzzwords to get us in the door, guys. Salesguys. Whaddayagonnado?
Eceguru: hey, it works with those both
gorclon1: lol
Eceguru: it supports many platforms
michaelwalsh327: (just playing)
salcs329: will two computers on a LAN (not connected to internet) work
starkiller76: When we first wrote the vision statement
Eceguru: i don't think so
starkiller76: The project was going to be developed in C++
Eceguru: you need acess to the rendezous nodes i think?
salcs329: thanks
starkiller76: Linux and wireless were more important at that point
michaelwalsh327: Isaac and Dave, I didn't mean to give you a hard time.
Eceguru: its ok
starkiller76: I know
kabev1: ok, anything else?
starkiller76: I just want to limit any confusion
x V DoGG x: did the groups pick which tools they are going to use?
x V DoGG x: if not, i would propose rejava for my group
kabev1: revjava it is
x V DoGG x: sorry revjava
michaelwalsh327: In terms of removing roles, I was thinking of getting rid of Business Designer Business-Model Reviewer Business-Process Analyst Capsule Designer and Database Designer. Any objections?
kabev1: nope
x V DoGG x: nope
gorclon1: no
starkiller76: none from me
se2srini: no
michaelwalsh327: (You guys can use rejava if you want, but you still have to help us find other tools)
x V DoGG x: mike - please update with your changes
x V DoGG x: the new roles page is linked off of the main project page
starkiller76: I will email you any other tools I find Mike
kabev1: I think everyone should spend some time tomorrow and search for tools
starkiller76: Yes
michaelwalsh327: Have you folks used Revjava before? Or just saw it from RJ's post?
starkiller76: Never heard of it before
Eceguru: never heard of it
salcs329: no
gorclon1: never heard of it myself
kabev1: I think Vivek's used it
x V DoGG x: mike - here is another metrics tool: http://www.hypercisioninc.com /jmetra/jmetradoc.html
se2srini: I just searched google! :-)
kabev1: alright so let's find tools, group 1 bring it to the meeting tomorrow
kabev1: anything else for tonight?
x V DoGG x: nope
se2srini: none
michaelwalsh327: Oh,m I have somethign:
gorclon1: ok
x V DoGG x: yes
salcs329: one more ques?
michaelwalsh327: Some of our wiki page names might be construed as polluting the namespace.
se2srini: mike or anyone else, did you add me to the sf project
x V DoGG x: true, i was thinking about that
michaelwalsh327: To respect other projects, present and future, we should prefix our pages with "LinuxWifi:" or something
kabev1: what's you id again, I'll add it
x V DoGG x: although no one has complained
x V DoGG x: and it is only "recommended" that we prefix
se2srini: kattragadda
michaelwalsh327: yea, but do you want to be a polluter, even if no one complains about it?
x V DoGG x: i think we should move all of the docs to sf
x V DoGG x: anyways
michaelwalsh327: You'll know...
salcs329: Q. What editor do you use to edit java code? Just notepad?
x V DoGG x: its not trivial to change the page, without loosing all the changes is it?
michaelwalsh327: You can download Visual Age for Java for free from IBM, but it's a bear.
x V DoGG x: i use visual cafe, but its $1000 if you want to shell it out
x V DoGG x: thanks motorola
michaelwalsh327: We can't change exisiting pages, but I thik we should have the prefix in the future. You can keep it out of your hyperlinks y saying
michaelwalsh327: [Roles>LinuxWifi:Roles]
x V DoGG x: ok
x V DoGG x: cool
x V DoGG x: i am cool with it
kabev1: ok your in
starkiller76: anyone who does not have a visual java development suite
starkiller76: should check out SunONE a
kabev1: alright guys I'm gonna get going
starkiller76: availible for free download on the Sun Java Site
salcs329: thanks..
x V DoGG x: me too
kabev1: I think there's a free trial of Borland JBuilder
se2srini: ok. thanks dave. are we done for today
x V DoGG x: i will put the log up
x V DoGG x: i have decided against summarizing
michaelwalsh327: i'm done.
x V DoGG x: since everyone seems to be attending
starkiller76: here is the link for Sun ONE
x V DoGG x: and i don't really have a ton of spare time
x V DoGG x: if someone else wants to... feel free
kabev1: out!!
starkiller76: http://wwws.sun.com/software/ sundev/jde/buy/index.html
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Eceguru: bye
Eceguru has left the room.
michaelwalsh327: bye
x V DoGG x has left the room.
michaelwalsh327 has left the room.
starkiller76: bye
se2srini has left the room.
gorclon1: byew